A teacher cannot achieve tenure until they put in a minimum of three of the four years of effective or higher ratings and quite a few teachers need five years as the Principal or Superintendent may want to delay tenure by giving the teacher an extra year for a myriad of reasons. if a teacher gets a developing or ineffective rating for the fourth year, the Principal or Superintendent can discontinue the teacher. Usually, if a teacher needs a second year of the extension of probation, his or her days are probably numbered. I know of many New York City teachers who were discontinued when they received a second year of probation.
A teacher who was discontinued in one New York City district can theoretically get another position in a different New York City district or has a license in another subject but few have dual licenses . However, there is a problem. The DOE will tell the principal of that district not to hire the discontinued teacher and to ensure that happens the DOE puts the discontinued teacher on a "do not hire list" and places a problem code on their file. What Principal would go against the DOE? None that I know of.
Therefore, once a New York City teacher is discontinued, forget about getting a teaching job in the New York City public school system.
22 comments:
Hi Chad
Can we discuss "Dear White teacher" manual for new teachers.
Thanks
bman
55/30
Chaz, two points: The "do not hire list" applies to teachers who received a C-31 letter in addition to their discontinuance/denial of tenure letter. However it is still extremely difficult to get back in even without the C-31 letter.
Secondly, there have been at least half a dozen teachers whom I personally know of who did get back into the DOE even after they were discontinued. One teacher even got tenure under the same license that she was discontinued under, so there is a glimmer of hope.
Does anyone know if there are any rules or regulations that govern class sizes as they relate to classroom sizes? My school had 2 kindergartens bumped out of their spaces for 3-K. They are now in rooms nearly half the size of the old rooms. It is really, really tight. Administration is still filling them with 25 students. It seems criminal to me.
If you get fired as a teacher can you come back as a para?
Anon 8:38
The answer is no since OPI will have you on the "do not hire" list. I know of a terminated teacher who tried to return as a para and was told that she cannot work for the DOE in any position.
I am working with someone right now who was discontinued in the Bronx and is now working in Brooklyn. Was a ballzy guy, untenured chapter leader, look what it got him
My admin has discontinued 3 teachers in the past 10 years. That number seems very high considering "only" about 500 have been discontinued citywide in recent years. Anybody else want to chime in on this?
The teachers are better off, now they can get a better job and not hang onto this corrupt system.
At my school we have vacancies that are hard to fill! The teacher shortage is a big problem! Where does the UFT stand here? It is an unfair system based on bias observations!
In the past so called "weak teachers" were given lots more support and mentoring! Observations were to discuss strategies for teachers to grow and learn!
Admins doing the observations are far from master teachers! Most are not expert in the discipline they observe! What a mess!
UFT where are you!!!
As far as contract goes and someone please correct me if I am wrong. Unions tell members if you get discontinued in a district then they can work in another district. However, I can tell you from experience that when people apply into another district there is a very good chance the person will get blocked. HR will block the person from being hired and will tell the principal this person can't be hired. Some principals can sometimes convince HR they still want the person but most can't. However, the Bronx is so desperate for teachers that the Bronx will allow discontinued teachers to slip through due to many vacancies. Other times the HR person simply doesn't see the discontinuance or is too overwhelmed to check.
This is why it is best for teachers to leave the school before they get discontinued. However, there are many stupid dumb stubborn teachers who feel "WHY should I leave? I AM awesome and this is my school." These teachers usually get discontinued when they could have taken another job elsewhere.
@1:58 pm . UFT was at the labor day parade...where were you?
Anon 7:10. Where did you come up with the 500 number? To me it seems a lot higher than that. Around 2015 which was when I was discontinued it was approximately 200+ per year. Also, you have to remember all the teachers who quit or resign in avoidance of a discontinuance
I know someone who was a para became a teacher was fired as a teacher and came back as a para.
The same principle took him back as a para.
8:38, as much as I respect Chaz, what he is telling you is not 100% accurate. Again, not every teacher who is discontinued is automatically placed on the "do not hire list. "You have to get cleared by OPI first then you can come back either in a different license area or another district. That has happened and it seems like it is happening more often than in the past. I'm not saying that it's realistic or easy, but it can happen. If I was you I would try another district instead of trying to return as a Para. Paras make half of what teachers make.
Anon 9:31
There are always exceptions but I wouldn't bet on you getting a job in the NYC school system once you are discontinued.
I know a guy too who taught and came back as a para. Same organization
Hi Chaz,
I am a science teacher who has switched licenses between physics and chemistry and in my 13th year of teaching without tenure. Should I be concerned if I get my probationary period extended to year 4? I have very little data for my current physics license and am still only teaching 1 section in it at a brand new school so I'm assuming it will be extended again since Super's usually want 2 years with a new principal before granting tenure.
Thanks,
A
My best guess you will have more succes teaching with your Chemistry license since most schools teach Chemistry while few schools teach physics in NYC.
I would try to get into a large school since the principal will more likely grant tenure without extending probation.
Shady, leaving a school is not that easy. You have to have a job lined up somewhere first as I am sure you know. Many people (myself included) who have tried to leave and were offered jobs at another school right before or during the summer were still hit with discontinuances.
The Bronx has hired several discontinued teachers in recent times Chaz. You could return to the Bronx and try to get a job somewhere else after a year or so.
to 6:25 PM. Many years ago a chapter leader at a large Queens high school looked into health and safety rules dealing with overcrowded spaces. He called the City department of health as well as FDNY. Basically he found out that most governmental agencies are exempt from OSHA and local laws. The FDNY told him that the allowed number of people in theaters, nightclub, etc., was calculated in cubic feet! So this old school building with high ceilings would not meet the overcrowding test and if it did the school would be exempt!
When I began teaching in the late sixties class sizes of 38 to 40 were the norm. The UFT negotiated the 34 to a class limit. The contract article was a joke because there were four exemptions to the class size rule - two that I remember were no available space to make a new class or no teacher available. The four exemptions mad the class size limit rule worthless.
It can be worse than what has just been described....
Subsequent to the discontinuance....the Rating Officer can charge a Teacher with an at of corporal punishment....
Does anyone know...WHERE in the contract this is addressed?
There "oughtaa" be a law....
Is the time limit one year...or three years....OR is it limitless???
S.O.S.
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