Saturday, March 09, 2019

Student Discipline Is Out Of Control In NYC Schools























The Blasio administration crowed that suspensions were down 50% and restorative justice programs were a success.  The truth is that if you ask the teachers, their school student discipline is out of control and that principals cannot suspend a student without the DOE's approval.  Moreover, the restorative justice programs are a joke as the misbehaving students quickly realize that there is little consequence for their misbehavior.  Finally, the allowing of cellphones bring chaos and distractions to the classroom.  Even the usually clueless UFT President Michael Mulgrew agreed that student discipline in NYC schools are out of control.

When I first started teaching a student that curses at a teacher would be suspended.  A student threatened a teacher would be arrested, and a student who was insubordinate to a teacher would get after school suspension.  Now all three student actions result in no consequences.  Combine that with the DOE's "blame the teacher for everything" mindset and the poor quality of administrators, especially the Leadership Academy principals, and the result is a chaotic school environment.

Just read these articles Here and Here. and this teacher won a "substantial settlement" from the DOE because of misbehaving students and incompetent school administrators Here.

You can read some of my previous posts dealing with student discipline Here, Here and Here.

36 comments:

Anonymous said...

I feel your pain sisters and brothers. for those of you caught in the "ATR" roller coaster its even worse. for me it was I had enough after 25 years and a so called "go to the light" opportunity in the form of a buyout I retired. after 6 years of bouncing around there was no party or that satisfaction of a career well done. for me it has been wondering what might have been. I left a little to early with a lot of baggage behind. good luck to you all, you will need it and have something else to go to, something that will keep you looking forward. even though I left i'm with you all.

Anonymous said...

Discipline has to be reinstated in the school system. Especially since parents have lost control or refuse to take responsibility for their children. Our mayor and the liberal policies in NYC are destroying the future of these kids. Scanning needs to be placed in every school and the discipline code needs to be rewritten.

I have worked in some of the most dangerous schools in NYC and the message is that these kids can get away with just about anything. How stupid of a school system to not discipline kids. Terrible message that is sent to the most out of control children. The mayor and his policies have to go or perhaps we need to hit rock bottom.

Anonymous said...

Liberal, PC policies are elitist, racist, Plantationist atrocities against these young people. 75% out of wedlock birth rate in inner city is the
PC sacred cow which makes you a racist when you mention it.We are expected to ignore this.reality...many millions of kids in these.public.schools with.no fathers....where are the fathers?

Anonymous said...

The reason this whole thing started was schools were rated on their suspension rates. If a school had a high suspension rate it was rated an unsafe school, while a school with a low suspension rate was labeled safe. The opposite is really true. If a school has a high suspension rate, that means that the administrators are not letting kids get away with their behaviors. If I were a parent and I wanted to protect my kid, I'd put him/her in the school with the high suspension rates. I'm waiting for the day this no punishment ideology hits the adult world. If I drive drunk will they not report it because my insurance will go up and that will discourage me? These schools are better illusionists than David Copperfield.

Anonymous said...

Word on street is the new discipline code was already negotiated and written.. We will see it in sept... This is all smoke and mirrors to set the stage for them to say they worked something out.

Can't wait to see it... The way mulgrew is talking, I'm assuming he wants more training for teachers.. Lol

Anonymous said...

No fathers. Cannot reiterate .
Cellphones and lax discipline sealed the coffins for the learning environment .Blame and frame the teachers. I see it daily. So happy I'm getting out this summer. 30 years special ed delinquents

Anonymous said...

The suspension sites were the only viable way that schools could release pressure that built up from the vile, disgusting, animals that now control the schools. With an individual school's report card being tied into suspensions what would any principal in their right mind suspend anyone? All I can say is let DeBlasio, DeBlasio's militant wife, or DeBlasio's kid with the 1970's afro spend a week in one one these hell holes then maybe he would restore suspensions. I think DeBlasio, the Chancellor and his flunkies are equally as clueless as well as the UFT that does not protect its teachers. Especially the Bronx UFT office that refuses to pick up the phone or return your calls.

Anonymous said...

Do people really believe that suspensions were ever intended to correct or influence the behavior of the kid suspended? The point of the suspension is to show everyone that there is a consequence for one's behavior. Removing the "bad apple" allows for order, discipline and education. The saying "One bad apple spoils the bunch" is centuries old.

Drunk driving is a crime because it endangers people and property. Drunk drivers, when caught are removed from the road, to secure the safety of others. If the DOE suits were in charge of the NYPD, the drunk driver would sit in a restorative circle with the police then allowed back on the road.

I do believe that the lack of discipline in the students starts in the home. There is not much the DOE can do about that. On the other hand, the schools, that are paid for by tax dollars, should ensure a safe, drug free, disciplined environment and a proper education for all who choose to be there and want the education. I do not think the majority of NYC public high schools provide this.

Anonymous said...

7:59 said..

"How stupid of a school system to not discipline kids." Maybe it's not out of stupidity, but it's more purposeful. School to prison. Allow students to create chaos at school. Continue chaotic behavior once they leave school. Arrested and put in jail.

9:26 said..

"many millions of kids in these.public.schools with.no fathers....where are the fathers?"
Exactly. The single thing that has destroyed the black community is the (financially incentivized through the welfare system) removal of the father from the home. Young women given financial incentives to have babies when they were not ready to be moms. Look up the Great Society Act. In 1965, 25% of black babies were born to single moms. Today it is 77%.

Anonymous said...

Stop you guys are making too much sense. Radical progressives dont like it!

waitingforsupport said...

My word

Anonymous said...

I have no father and I’m a NYC public school teacher at top salary.

The problem isn’t one or two or three parent(s)… it’s that no one with the label of parent is parenting. If someone in a kid’s life said no to them and controlled misbehavior outside of school, there wouldn’t be the problem we have in schools. It isn’t about race or money, it’s about the lack of parenting. And, since parents don’t parent, they don’t want schools to do their job (because they are perfect so their kids are perfect) and the administrators are cowards so they do nothing to upset the parents. Therefore, teachers suffer and kid’s whose parents actually parent them suffer.

Knock off the racist comments.

Anonymous said...

We do not educate American kids any longer. Mostly we are educating the kids from central and south america, muslims from the middle east, dominican republic and mexico.

Wake up gullible people as the US has had open borders for decades now and we are all seeing the consequences. The cultures we are educating see the world with their lenses and so they all want to come to America and instill their lenses to the American way of life after their failed countries.

AOC screaming that American policies are this and that yet her home country where her family is of PR is in shambles. Congresswoman ilhan omar telling Americans how we should live and about American policies yet she lived in a tent in somalia and was given refuge by America but she still wants to instill her world through her lenses mentality. No, the immigration of the US is a disaster and we are all paying for it both financially and emotionally.

Anonymous said...

Where is the "racism"...? Where r the fathers? Out of wedlock births r rising in white demographics as well, but teachers in NYC predominantly see the results of single Mom, Welfare State kids daily.We r merely reporting reality. But, yes, certain parents across the board racially, r not parenting these kids. Apparently, these kids never hear the word "No" in their young lives, which makes the lowly teacher's job impossible. Ive been cursed out, and worse, by 6th grade whites as well, but this school system is predominantly minority/ELL now.But that doesnt remove the reality of 75%, OR MORE, fatherless kids in inner city groups. Again, where r the fathers of the 75%??? To ask this question is now considered "racist"? Just answer the question...but I dont think u will,can, or want to. Much easier to point fingers and avoid these glaring stats.

Anonymous said...

Kids can do anything and teachers have to watch their step yet if the administration observes you and the kids are uncooperative then it is you who gets in trouble!!! If a kid is wearing a hat or on the phone guess who gets a letter in their file????

Anonymous said...

The overall out of wedlock rate in this country now is 40%, across all groups! This is outrageous. And of course were not counting all of the aborted fetuses ...Also, the OOW demographic that is rising the most currently is immigrant Hispanic mothers! Also, the native born Hispanic rate overall is very high, over 50%.

The lowest rates are the Asian/Pacific Islanders, both immigrants and citizens..Funny...Ive NEVER been dissed by any Asian Pacific Islander kid in all my time in these schools...and Im in over 20 years.

Anonymous said...

Suspensions don't work, that's why they are no longer used. I'm not saying what we currently have does work but certainly reinstituting suspensions won't help. Also, have any of you teachers thought, "maybe I'm the problem?" When you look at the kids as animals they will act accordingly. I've taught for 10 years now in some of the "worst" schools in the city and rarely do I have behavioral issues. Is it because the kids I teach are saints? No, of course not. It is because I do what teachers are suppose to do and teach them to care about their community and themselves.

The longer I work in education, the more I see everything is about "passing the buck". It's funny, the commentors on this blog are frequently conservatives complaining about liberal policies, terrible admin, and "wild" students. Stop playing the victim already, isn't that suppose to be the job of the liberals you guys claim have destroyed the system?

Anon said...

Anon. 8:09

I too was raised without a father, and I retired last year at top salary.

You write "No one with the label of parent is parenting".... really? That's patently false. There are many wonderful. well adjusted students with outstanding, responsible, loving parents throughout the system. These colleagues are pointing out something no one wants to deal with. My school demographic was approx. 55% Latino, 40% Black, and the rest "others". Sadly, it was all too often the fatherless African American students who wandered the halls, oblivious to the fact that they were in a school building, and that this was their only opportunity to change their destinies. These were the students satisfied with 65s, who often disrupted class, acted out, fought with each other and generally made life intolerable for the other students. At parent teacher conferences, it was the parents of these students who failed to show up. Facts aren't racist, and denial isn't a river in Africa. One cannot "knock off" the reality in front of their faces each day. If your experience is that "no one" is parenting, I wonder how much disdain YOU have for your students. You paint with a very broad brush.

Anonymous said...

9:42- I just have disdain for all the people who continue to write a racist, often right-wing narratives.

I’m going to assume most of the people here are trolls, because I cannot imagine most of you in a classroom.




Anonymous said...

Chaz — can you make sure the reply to 9:42 is anon. — I just wrote it and i think I clicked anon.

Thanks.

Anon said...

Anon 5:38

Calling your colleagues, i.e. me, "trolls" and "racists" is a typical response by those who cannot construct a logical, cogent response to the difficult facts some of us face, and resort to virtue signaling instead. This country has destroyed the Black family in too many ways to mention here.Have you ever heard of the achievement gap or Black on Black crime? Ever been to a funeral for a 13 yr. old student killed over nothing? Ever have a student locked up for murder? I have, and can't imagine you surviving a day in the schools I've taught in.

Clipping Path said...

I really like and appreciate your post.Thanks Again. Keep writing.

Anonymous said...

9:39-What do you mean by suspensions don't work? What do you believe is the purpose of the suspension?

I agree that educators should care about their students, their education and to "care about their community and themselves." On the other hand, to accept an injustice or a wrong doing simply because it is not done to you is a problem. To turn a blind eye to immoral behavior, violent behavior, threats, etc perpetuates the problem. If students have it in them to misbehave, threaten, disrupt classes, be so earnestly uncivil to other teachers and students, eventually it will come around to you.

I am curious if your students feel emboldened to misbehave for other teachers because you encourage them to believe that they, the students, are not responsible for their behavior. Being "friends" with your students is not helping them. You are not teaching them to be disciplined and that success is hard work. I hope that you are not forgoing the teaching of a major subject in order to be in good standing with your students.

I am also curious about your "having worked 10 years in the worst schools" means that you have been in multiple schools. If you have such an easy time of it, why are you in multiple schools?

I see the comments on this blog about the state of education to come from a place of concern and passion for children and education as opposed to complaints. Why is it that when a conservative is passionate it is seen as a complaint?


Anonymous said...

So...u censor too...?

Anonymous said...

@6:53 I never said I was "friends" with the students nor do I embolden them by telling them their actions do not have consequences. On the contrary, students do not misbehave in my classroom because they know that they will actually receive fair and consistent consequences based upon this. Just because I do not believe in punishments that only punish rather than teach does not mean I am permissive and nor do I care more about my students liking me then ensuring they have a good future. As I stated in my first comment, when you teach students to care about their community, you receive better results then when you just eject them from said community.

I also do not have problems with genuinely conservative responses to the problems we face. What I do have a problem with is racists masquerading as conservatives who claim the students are "animals" and blame "liberal" policies for the current state of things. Many of these problems stem from the Bloomberg era and last I checked, Bloomberg was a centrist-moderate.

As for me saying multiple schools, that only means more than 1. In ten years I have taught at two schools, one a middle school and the other a high school.

Anonymous said...

Regarding this being a "conservative" board, this is the only teacher blognthat doesnt censor unpopular non PC opinions. Both Ednotes, and NYC Educator heavily censor comments that are non PC, or deviate from their world view. Chaz is the only one who will allow all sides.

waitingforsupport said...

You're not alone @5:38 PM. Unfortunately a REAL discussion will not and cannot take place this way. The "facts" are seen via a certain type of lens. Until all parties can sit and talk together, we will continue to hear venting and finger pointing. I don't want to say right or left wing because nothing will be resolved. If we want to have a strong country, we have to do things differently. If not, lol, the s#%$ hits the industrial-sized fan. Racist folks rarely believe they are racists. They just "read the papers, listen to the news and/or immediate environment and say, "see, they are not any good". Anyway, it is what it is.

Anonymous said...

DeBlasio and Carmen Farina said "suspending blacks and hispanics is racist. Blacks and hispanics do not know any better and do not know how to behave." We need to find alternative ways to correct their behavior. For example, when one of my students urinated in the garbage can in front of the class - I did not kick him out of class. I asked him to go wash his hands but he refused. This is an example of positive behavior.

Anonymous said...

Add that the police would be brought up on charges the drunk driver made up, and the police precinct would be closed and replaced by bargain rate charter police.

waitingforsupport said...

...and that's why we need to eliminate the SHSSAT. It's simply another way to game the system. I always said just because students attend specialized schools or ivy league colleges doesn't ALWAYS mean they are smarter. Sometimes it means they have morally bankrupt people in their corner. Yes, it isn't like cursing out a teacher or walking around acting entitled...or is it. My my my...what is going on in this world? I hope this gets posted.

Anonymous said...

Yes, I have been to funerals for my students.

Yes, I have a student in jail for murder.

I also have students who have graduated from Ivy league schools.

Does that make you feel better?

Anon said...

Great! Then you know that SOME parents are parenting, disproving your premise "No one is parenting" that I contested. You ARE capable of making sense, unless you take total credit for your student's success! By the way, my Visual Arts students earned over 10 million dollars in scholarships to the best Art schools in the country. Most were Black and Latino, all were from low income families, and most now have incredible careers. Some earn more than you.

Anon said...

Also, since we're keepin it real here, didn't standing in front of your student's casket cause an epiphany, that this stupid, senseless violence has to stop? That it is devastating the Black and Latino communities, and that this in turn demands attention and healing? I think that minus your labeling me and others here, we are really on the same side, and want the best for our students. That's why I devoted 30 years to serving title 1 students. I just did it minus the PC virtue signaling. By the way, I also grew up in the Hood.

waitingforsupport said...

I'm not trying to feel better. I actually feel great. However you sound as if I attacked you.

waitingforsupport said...

@11:12am...fabulous. You had a hand in their success. You sound like a caring teacher

Anon said...

So do you, Waitingforsupport!
Thanks very much for the acknowledgement!
Have a great weekend!